I don't like D&D....

I think the system is cold and mechanical and while 3rd edition did a lot to simplify it, it didn't really make it better IMO... makes me think of a fighting game more then anything else.

But that's my problem... I have a chronicle idea involving dragons, liches, orcs etc. You know the deal.

So I'm not sure which game to play that in. I was thinking Lo5R, with a lot of tweaking the story could be converted... but I'd like to know you guys opinion?

Do you want this to be a traditional fantasy or are you intrested in something a little more......out there?

I can't really help you if your looking for traditional fantasy, 3E D&D works fine for me, just some minor tweaking is all that is needed.

I, however, love the idea of modern day fantasy. Take your standard fantasy conventions (dragons, orcs, magic users, dungeons, etc.) and bring them into the modern world. Add in a dash of the WoD and, Voila!

There is actually a game (no longer in production anymore, unfortunately) that does this amazingly well. It is called "The Everlasting" by Visionary Esntertainment Studios Inc. The only thing that you may want to change is the fact that the players play immortal supernatural creatures, ranging from various undead, to angels and holy warriors, to old fallen gods, to elves dragons and faeries.

I know of a site that has a system based on D&D, but it's been changed so much that you'll really have to see it for yourself. You can find it at http://www.dimfuture.net/elsewhere/roleplaying.html .

off top of my head i can think of several good games for fantesy in different time frames.

Palladium Fantesy RPG
Rifts
Shadowrun

At the risk of sounding like a broken record I'd recommend GURPS:Fantasy for any fantasy campaign. You can adjust the realism level as much as you want by adjusting character point costs or by using the cinematic version of the rules. Also you have so much support from different sourcebooks that you can't go wrong. Also to start off all you need is the GURPS basic set.

At the risk of adding to your stew of choices, or just promoting your earlier idea, might I susgest you run with you L5R idea. Shadowlands creatures come in all shapes and sizes, allowing you to include whatever you might wish. It is also (usually) a very restrained game, in that most characters tend to be very polite to one another and npcs. Its a hard game to twist the rules to allow powergaming.

On another note, perhaps the game for you is Warhammer. A very good game for what you describe, without the pitfalls of killing orientated advancement. It can make for some fun roleplaying, (and for those who love combat, the critical hit section is a must).
If you want more information let me know.

Nah, it would have to be "medival" fantasy setting (or feudal japan). I really like the idea of them having to walk/ride horses and the whole idea of little isolated villages needing help and stuff like that.

It's classical and corny, but after over 6 years of never touching that classical corny stuff, I'm starting to miss it.

Warhammer might be worth a try...

A question tho, how do you make a 'lich' in L05R? I was thinking about an 'evil' Shugenja who just has an 'alter-ego' and who is trying to take over while his other personna is somebody's advisor or what not...

But then you lose the whole 'undead' thing.

Well GURPS, is good for what you want, or so it seems. I am not sure about L5R, it would take a fair bit of work and is made to evoke a different feel. Warhammer is most definatly not high fantasy, its nasty, dirty and people die a lot.

If you want low fantasy go for Warhammer, otherwise I'd suggest GURPS. Actually for atmosphere I'd suggest Dragon Warriors but you can't get the game anymore...the atmosphere was great though.

Maybe you should use BESM. The rules you can use for pretty much anything, and they can be tweaked for how much combat/roleplaying you really want. They even have rules for making up whatever you wish. The website has quick-start rules if you want to have a look. The addy is http://www.guardiansorder.on.ca/

Had a look though that page. BESM...Strange game but I'd love to play it. Apeals to the Anime nut in me.

Winter Heart, L5R is okay, but it isn't high fantasy. As for the lich idea, the Way of the Shadowlands Book just came out. Also, you can use the "Shadow" with some work.

Just curious. But did you decide on a system?

Actually, no I didn't.

I started an Aberrant game instead and got to play in a D&D3 game... and IMO, it does still suck. There's just something about the combat system that is bad, I simply don't feel involved. While the whole "I attack/dodge/block/split my dice pool!" made you nervous and care for every roll in WWGS games, D&D battle are VERY boring. I hardly even follow them, do what I have to do and doodle on my char sheet, I mean, me being councious or not as no revelance whatsoever on weither or not the DM's monster hit me or not. And good god are they a lot of battles! But still, it sastisfy my sword and sorcery craving for now... still you'd think that in such a battle centric world, they'd make up an enjoyable combat system.

And if I do run this game, it will probably be with WarHammer (or Rolemaster), that is if I can make enough money the get the books...

I dunno, I guess high fantasy doesn't appel to me anymore, however the idea of a gritty and scary fantasy words sinks right in (not Ravenloft-esque scary tho).

If you want a very stuctured combat system where you care what you roll, and where it factors likke cover/conceament, flanking, positioning, etc have a great impact: Rolemaster, but be prepared for a very slow game, at least until you get it down. Also have a calculater. A highly skills emphasis game, in which if done right is mainly for role paying, (partly because a dungeon Crawl with enemy after enemy) would take literly forever.

The system works well with fanatasy, Anime, modern, and ultra Modern.

BUT Rolemaster does not work well with a high magic setting like... Forgotten realms, or with ultra Powerful enemies like dragons, liches etc, unless the Characters are well Made, and have a decent level as well. The worst thing about a highly combative rolemaster game, is one single good roll can quickly leave a Villian/character dead where he stands, due to how the Hit charts are structured, but you can use a fate point system to help out if need be.

A VERY realistic game where two men in Plate mail w/ swords and shields, will get tired before the kill each other.. But a good shot from a matchlock will drop where they stand. And beware if in modern setting and laser or plasma weapons are used... this spells death even for many minor hits.....

Calculator for rolemaster????

The system is d100 + skill - modifier. I've never needed a caluclator for that and I GMed RM for something like 4 years.

The only time it came in handy was with some of the odder perutations of two weapon fighting skill.

RM2 (the previous edition) does high magic well. The current RMSS or whatever they are calling it is a bit lower powered but can still do high magic well if you just up the PC and NPC levels a bit. A 30th level mage in RM can do some nasty stuff.

Fate Points or some variant is HIGHLY reccomended in RM. As you say the crits mean that anyone can die in combat. It really sucks to sepend a lot of time making a PC only to have them die in one of the first few combats.

Outside of RM I still like DragonQuest. Old old game but I like it.

Oh, Xzaviar I just realized that prior to your post the last post in this therad was made nearly two years ago. What's up with bringing something that old up to the top of the queue?

Ya know, didn;t pay that much attention, not much else to do but rant a lil..But now you mentioned it, guess I sorta Beating a dead horse eh?

Personally, I recomend GURPS. that system has the ability to scale to any level you want, from little farmer boys out seeking their lot in life, to earth shattering dragon hunters. All the rules are flexible unto themselves, changing an aspect about the magic isn't going to affect the way a sword does damage.

If you need any help with GURPS, I would be more than willing to offer advice. Been playing it for 15 years or so.